The official Reddit community (subreddit) for Bitcoin is r/bitcoin. MarketBeat Community Rating for Bitcoin (BTC) MarketBeat's community ratings are surveys of what our community members think about Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies. Vote "Outperform" if you believe the stock will outperform other cryptocurrencies over the long term. Four-year cycle, smart money chart are some ways people divide the market to see trends. (Nerdy lines, you can skip this paragraph) I apply standard deviation on the daily close data of bitcoin to obtain its volatility. Then I would had applied day moving average, following it with a gaussian filter with a sigma of 3 to smoothen it out. Additionally, stock markets have been around in the U.S. since the late s. Bitcoin is, on the other hand, a relatively new asset originating in the late s. The history just isn’t there for Bitcoin if you like a long-term track record.
Reddit stock market bitcoinBitcoin’s 8 Years Annualized Returns Beats Stock Market 10 times : StockMarket
It's a commodity at this point. The rest of the crypto market still goes after new and different ideas but Bitcoin pretty much found itself as base commodity in the digital world.
Crypto is not a commodity, the literal definition of a commodity is as follows: a raw material or primary agricultural product that can be bought and sold, such as copper or coffee.
Bitcoin does not have any industrial or other clear use expect for being viewed as a store of value and an investment asset. Buying drugs and illegal porn online and letting North Korea convert coal into money despite sanctions.
Yeah if only it was like the U. Dollar which isn't used in the facilitation of any illegal activities throughout the world. Also, don't forget The argument that bitcoin is bad because Apologies, English isn't my first language. But I think it's still clear that I wanted to compare it to gold an such, rather than a currency or tool.
Gold only has value because we give it so, and the same goes for bitcoin. Edit: made the last sentence in bold, apparently, a lot of people missed that or intentionally ignored that. Which is also a reason it will crash. Once there is no longer an incentive to keep the network running, nodes go offline, thus making it much more decentralized. The idea is that transaction fees will be the incentive.
With a high enough BtC price, it will be economical. But we still recognize it as a store of value. Not as good as a cash for short term holding but you can confidently hold it with some modest fluctuations of a few percentage points to be expected over short periods.
I don't understand how someone can back gold and shit on BTC in the same sentence, the cognitive dissonance is astounding. And my point remains. Gold has utility. Do you know how much gold and other mined materials are required to created GPUs to mine bitcoin?
Wow who would have thought carrying a virtual currency is easier than a physical asset like gold There is no justification to its valuation. Gold does have actual use in the world, and it is also visually attractive. Bitcoin uses a ton of energy to mine and is not a physical asset. Well is a stock a physical asset? You're completely discounting the fact that gold is desirable by people for vanity reasons. That's real demand. It's similar but unlike gold, the volatility prevents it from being used as an exchange medium.
If you buy a burger with Bitcoin, you don't know what you're paying, and the person receiving it doesn't know how much they're getting both those quantities can be different. I have bitcoin, but I mined it. I'm keeping it for the time being, but I'm not going to put money there. Good luck to everyone that does.
I do not know of a place where I can buy a burger in chunks of gold. Not that there isn't one, it just probably isn't a business.
I'm not disagreeing or agreeing, clearly this reply isn't serious. Well, you should get out of your country more then. You can go to any place in the world with gold and everyone knows what it is. It has endured over years of being used as an exchange medium. I have 3 passports. Maybe you need to really travel. You're welcome. A friend gifted me 0. I held on to it mostly because it was still with said friend and was too lazy to ask em to cash it out for me HAHA.
That level of volatility also makes it completely useless as both a currency and a store of value. I still don't understand it and because of that, I won't invest in it. But I am willing to entertain the possibility that even though I don't see the value in it, it does not mean it is worthless.
I might be just too old and stupid to grasp it. Agree with you. Store of value is a closer description, but still not perfect.
As liquidity comes and the space continues to mature, volatility will continue to smooth out. The price is following a log curve and will flatten out over time, although there is undoubtedly a ton of hype and fomo surrounding it. But maybe there's something underneath it that's been getting banks and hedge funds and all those retail buyers to fomo in the past few years?
As with any investment, probably best to stay away if you don't understand it, although I do urge you to try and understand it a bit more. Good luck. The issue also being that there is a cap on how many not size, but amount transactions can be made in a finite time period.
You'd then think that you could size up the operation to allow for more transactions, but no. The complexity of the calculations required are increasing to ensure you always have this stupid blocker, and sure, while it guarantees miners some profit, it also hinders liquidity. And sure, there's now all sorts of ideas on how to fix it, but it's so dumb.
They've created a system that's flawed, then the only real fix mutes the advantages of the system. At least the BCash fork tried to solve it in a way that's closer to what was intended, but as they didn't keep the name it's also mute, because again, it's all just hype and FOMO.
I don't think Bitcoin is a ponzi scheme, but it's a digital currency that doesn't work as a currency and it's only lease on life is speculation. Etherium I have more hopes for, but it doesn't have any kind of wide spread recognition, and frankly, I think the name sucks.
But on a more serious note, I think people are caught up in all the potential of new digital currencies and just don't understand how to put their money into it. They're 'investing' in a currency when they should be investing in the infrastructure around it. With all the scams, failed ICOs and all together 0 investor protection, I do not think retail investors should be considering new digital currencies as anything more than what it currently is.
FOMO, hype, and a quick way to lose everything you put into it. Anything accepted by certain group of people as means of good exchange is a currency.
Whether you agree or not btc count as a currency now. Secondly, if the curve flattens, and a large portion of investors are there only for the speculative potential, wouldn't they then sell? And that would lead to a drop in price which would cause folks to lose interest in investing leading to a more dramatic selloff? Not really. You can break up BTC into millionths of a coin. So you can take a dollar and get. Still works out. Sure they might. Unlike your otm calls, Bitcoin was designed to be a store of value.
All forex and currency investment gold but not really silver is a hedge against inflation. Btc is just something different. I heard a story of a guy's uncle going through a transition of currency from their local country, to the euro.
His uncle has used this new form of currency the euro for over 20 years now. He still uses the old denomination to do any conversion. He is just too used to his old currency, even though it's completely gone. It's not that people don't understand Bitcoin, it's more that they don't understand its valuation. I guess people also don't understand if it's a currency or an asset.
What I meant is, I think your average person doesn't know how to spend Bitcoin or invest in it. People don't understand bitcoin either, I'll bet the majority of people ragging on it in this thread don't know what blockchain really is. I'll bet half the people who invest in bitcoin don't know what it is either, for that matter lol. I find it hard to not see the unique value proposition in Bitcoin.
No, I don't see how it's worth this much of a market cap but I absolutely see this technology or concept becoming more and more widespread in a digital world during an age of a security arms race. Can we put a price on security and authenticity in an age of hackers and fake news?
Perhaps we are with Bitcoin, and being too stuck in your ways to not invest a couple percent in it is foolish. Let them be old. It's just part of being old. Even most of the SP companies will die out just like the old.
Never touch bit coin again. Anciently, metals were used as currency because they had raw value as a commodity, so in a lot of ways it only makes sense that in an age where data is a commodity, data is also made into currency.
I could get more philosophical about why I think crypto is the future of currency, but those are some of the main points that got me thinking it was worthwhile to invest. I think right now, with a lack of regulation and crypto still in its early stages, it's kinda like the wild west. Crypto itself is still mostly a trading instrument in most places although China does use it a lot for actual transactions I think , so most people just treat it as a way to make a quick buck. However, I've recently started to learn about some of the more amazing uses for blockchain tech the tech underlying bitcoin and all cryptos and that seems really promising to me even if crypto as a whole fades into irrelevance.
For example, some places are using blockchain tech in conjunction with retina scans to track allotments of humanitarian aid for buying groceries in refugee camps where there is no standard currency.
You dont need to understand. Its a fking scam being pump by those big exchange with unlimited tether. If the goverment wouldve stop that scamming usdt tether. You can watch the whole crypto space collapse overnight. People often ask me to show proof. The proof is its volatility and unnatural price movement.
By early on do you mean any time this year? If you bought in march you'd be up 8x. Any other time, 2x. Next up is solving the high transaction fees. My moneys on both but more-so on LTC.
I don't understand the comparision. Why is a single crypto being compared to a whole stock market? Picking the best performing crypto vs best performing stock would be a much more fair comparision. So many such articles are just selective stat picking. All I know is there has been more talk about price than tech in last 8 years in the crypto space. Like utter garbage. Only Bitcoin and Ethereum have complete legitimacy and stood on the test of time. Stablecoins are useful but I don't consider them cryptocurrencies.
The rest of cryptocurrencies are scams or centralized shit. I was just immediately selling and converting to BTC, and transferring to coinbase to sell for cash. Believe me, won't really be worth it these days.
I have a Super. The market is basically Bitcoin and Ethereum and other coins are absolute garbage. I just hold Bitcoin and trust the anti-inflation.
Or possibly picking the best crypto and comparing it to the best fiat currency would be more applicable? Or to gold? That would make the numbers look even more dramatic. That said I think bitcoin is a terrible store of value because its so volatile and is a terrible currency because the blockchain is slow and so few retails accept it.
So I guess right now bitcoin is a commodity with a finite amount and a speculative investment. Doesn't mean it won't triple in value but also doesn't mean it might crash back down to 10k levels. Yes btc is both a terrible store of value and terrible payment currency. That's y comparing it for purely speculative investment purposes only makes sense. Its a speculative investment that may hedge against inflation and currency risk, hence the gold comparisons. There are other cryptos that are good for buying things, but like you said, bitcoin isnt one of them.
Speculative and hedge cannot be used for same asset. It's either or. Stocks and crytpo don't fit the bill since they are volatile. What timeframe do you use to assess volatility? Surely you don't consider stocks a store of value either then Just saying. Eventually it will have normal fluctuations based mainly on economic conditions but until then it will be driven by speculation about whether that future will become a reality and at what level it will finally settle.
It is therefore a speculative store of value at the moment. Terrible store of value but literally anybody who bought it ever in history would be in the profit right now.
I think it's still a valid comparison. Bitcoin is such a huge portion of cryptocurrency, that you can get a feel of how the entire market is doing by just looking at its price. I totally agree with this, seems like they always choose an arbitrary start-date. Not sure what value this article really adds. Anyone can select a timeframe over which X asset class outperforms Y asset class. Only hindsight can tell you which is which - but past performance is rarely an indicator of future results.
Idiot ancestors? Silver is heavily used in every technology sector there is. From space exploration to computers to medical. Gold has a ton of uses other than jewelry as well. This kind of information is very typical for crypto subreddits to cheer on and twist into different forms ad nauseam. There has been shit ton of filings with SEC through the last 4 years of crypto world, maybe this one will finally stick, maybe it wont, we'll see.
Oh okay so I guess the PM of their fixed income strategy is feeding the banks bs. Just passing along a message. I honestly do not know, i am just a random internet person trying to make sense of it. But yes, we will see, time will tell. Tether is not just used by those trading bitcoin, but also those trading all cryptos available through their exchange.
New data show how dominant Tether has become as a trading pair on crypto exchanges. So Tether has become the dominant crypto trading pair, what does this mean for artificial manipulation of the price? I don't know the answer to this question, but a research paper on tether and bitcoin in was published, which may have the answer.
Professor John Griffin is the James A. I don't have the technical chops to understand that paper, but I'm curious what you think of the paper, as the question you brought up makes a lot of sense to me.
But the paper seems to have a lot of support and there was a lot less tether in Common misunderstanding. Thorough research can link if you want to has proven, that due to the nature of very thin order books, real fiat : MC ratio, specially during the more greedier part of the market cycles, is at least. On top of that, due to the pairings between crypto assets, it inflates the prices even higher.
So in simple calculation, Then you have many more billions in other stablecoins, of which many are by majority minted by using crypto assets as a packing. Mainly Ethereum for example. As a simple explanation, someone has 10 ethereum, through defi will mint himself enough dai or whatever stablecoins to purchase another 5 ethereum, essentially using this mechanism as a leverage tool. I am a bit busy to explain it further, but your comment seriously lacks in understanding of the nature how this whole system operates.
Please take only very little time to get a better understanding on this matter. On tether usage. Let me ask you this, during the absolute peak euphoria in , with large part of world attention on crypto.
How realistic do you think, that back then, at the absolute peak in December , that 1. And that does not even take into account billions of other stablecoins, that are now in circulation, which were not present in I absolutely would like links to additional research. If it only takes a small amount of time to understand it better, can you please give me a simple explanation of how it operates?
The example you posed to me regarding ethereum and dai doesn't show an unbacked currency being minted out of thin air to manipulate price. It shows a speculator using collateral to obtain leverage, right? Using this example, I still have no idea where you get the 20x leverage from? Let me clarify a bit. Main points: - Tether is used to prop up and manipulate bitcoin price. Outright scam, unpacked printed tether, buy bitcoin off exchange, inflate price of bitcoin and claim that bitcoin as your collateral packing for your minted tether.
Rinse and repeat ad nauseam. I guess this guy is going to be standing on the sidelines as bitcoin hits k soon like Wall Street analysts have suggested. Well if Wall Street analysts said it, it must be true. After all those Wall Street boys always have your best interests in mind. Finally the first thing you've said that I agree with. But it's just as well. We will - after all - still need wage cucks trying to make a few dollars in their k.
Bitcoin is not a viable currency. However, there are other crypto currencies out there like lite coin that could work. It's clear that Bitcoin is getting pumped like a mofo so that idiots buy into it and become bagholders.
Think about the scarcity of Bitcoin. Bitcoin was supposed to replace all currencies It cannot be used for daily transactions because it's too fucking slow. I was just clarifying that for any dip shit that thought otherwise. Bitcoin was supposed to replace middle men and speed up transactions.
But it is too slow, too volatile and isn't widely accepted, which means it fails it's primary function as a currency. Many payments processors now have near real time transactions, faster than bitcoin, are more widely accepted and are integrated into the financial system. Bitcoin is a digital store of wealth, it will never be a currency like the dollar, euro or sterling.
I own bitcoin, but I don't anticipate ever buying as much as a coffee with it. Do please enlighten us. What is the vision for buying a currency that cannot be used on a regular basis? What is the point in buying "virtual gold" without any intrinsic value? Do we really need another asset whose value is contingent on people agreeing that it is valuable?
What makes bitcoin more valuable than any of the other cryptocurrencies? This shit is retarted and people investing in this crap are going to lose their shirts sooner or later. You think gold - which is a material that will shortly be in mass abundance will remain a hedge of value?
Are you over 45 years old? Do you think PayPal accepting bitcoin for every payment for every item sold on its platform opens bitcoin to more or less potential uses? There is no way that's going to happen in the next years I am aware that there are asteroids is space with trillions of dollars worth of precious metals. This has been talked about since like and will continue to be talked about for the next couple of decades. Either way, investing in Bitcoin is still not that much better of an alternative.
More and more cryptocurrencies will continues to be created, making Bitcoin just another one on the list. That's stupid. How was this meant to be a currency then? If everyone can set the price of a coin to whatever his or her little heart desires. Bitcoin will fail and I hope you don't end up losing your shirt because of it.
Good luck! Shit, someone show this incredible DD to druck and raoul pal and morehead, tapiero and novogratz. If it fades into another hundreds of Gartner hype cycle examples from the past, their business will fade or even worse will be shut down due to lack of demand. If there is another retail boom however, they will cash out big time.
So to assume, that big guys are not aware or i would dare to say, included in this mafia thing, is very naive, try not to be so gullible. Pick any major exchange, Coinbase, Huobi, Binance, Kraken, all of those where one can follow where tether treasury sends its tether soon after minting them and soon after withdraws bitcoins, they are all part of this fuckery. No one cares about this stuff as long as they are making money, so no one would listen to you. People only care or cry about this stuff after they lose money, just like ponzi and Madoff.
Unfortunately i think you are right. Specially the downvote wave of supporters, who take even slight criticism as a personal attack. While Tether has a bunch of weak points, and good arguments of criticism should be given deep consideration from investors, I cannot take a graph without proper axes labeling serious.
In case someone didn't catch that, the black graph, labelled as 'google searches for bitcoin' is mapped to some dimension which is not visible in the graph, but used as a measure for the disproportionate printing of tether vs. You should compare using the same units, but the agenda is not to inform now, is it? Graph is just a very simplified representation, showing a rather clear correlation between price and tether circulation supply.
One can obviously say, that it is just either a coincidence or the demand for such an exponential increase for tether is very real, perhaps it is, but all facts out there, i personally do not think it is the case.
If you want more details into the theory i proposed, there is plenty of thorough documents out there that go into much more detail. One for example is the one i posted at the very top of my original post. It is a legal document, pages long and supports my theory rather well. I have expressed my "agenda" in the original post and all over the comments and that is to rise awareness and by doing so, try to probably somewhat naively protect unlucky people, who do not know any better, from losing their hard earned money.
If you do not mind, let me ask you, do you suggest that my real agenda is, as crypto people like to call it, spreading FUD? And if that is correct, may i ask you, how naive and gullible would i have to be, to think, that random reddit post would have absolutely any effect on the price of cryptocurrencies and their future. I am just trying to do good in hopes, that i can save some people their hard earned money. Simple as that. Anything crypto should be treated with utmost care, the amount of false information in this space is beyond the factual information by orders of magnitude.
Bitcoin will reach that market cap alone, the overall crypto market cap will be more. Not sure how long it will stay above that level though! That's how bullish I am. I take it back. I've been doing well with stocks. You don't need to gamble on bitcoin to make money. There are plenty of opportunities out there to grow your money.
I checked out after your tether rant. Have fun jumping off a bridge when it hits k. So any fact based check the fucking page document with plethora of proof i linked criticism, that has any slight counter arguments towards your dreams and hopes of a lambo, is stupid ass fucker who should jump off the bridge and die? Step out of your ridiculous censored cult subreddits and at least try to understand counter arguments.
In the very essence of crypto ponzi pyramid, just know, that even if you do get lucky and be the absolute master to nail selling the very top, there has to be many others below you who will be left holding the worthless bags.
Only way for you to win, is to many others to lose their hard earned money, those are your ordinary everyday moms and dads, grandparents, brothers and sisters etc. That is what this shit is all about, it does not produce any fucking product, service nor does it bring any additional value to people and society. So for someone, who tries to protect these people from losing their money, to tell me to jump off the bridge, take a critical look in the mirror, your life principles and by all means, GO.
I understand well what you are getting at, but I encourage you to spend more time trying to articulate your thoughts more clearly. Several lines of what you wrote are confusing simply because they are not complete sentences. The figure you provided, however, does well to make your point.
Regarding your point, BitCoin is just another fiat currency not unlike any other fiat currency. I assure you, yes, BitCoin will crash some day and it will also soar after that and eventually crash again, just like any fiat currency.
When you mentioned Gold 2. I wonder if that resulted in a similar level of fuckery just on a devolved scale. Back in , they claimed they had packing equivalent in USD, which after ongoing lawsuits etc, soon changed their statement into "packing partially by USD". And that was pack in , when there were "only" 1. Somewhere along the years , they again changed their statement, that it is not quite packed in USD, but in USD and other assets, by which they mean essentially bitcoin.
In they have so far printed additional Then make another mouse click, print another 1B, rising bitcoin even further etc etc, rinse and repeat until ad nauseam if necessary. True, censorship in communities, subreddits etc. You can make a mistake and you lose everything without any recourse. Same thing if you get hacked or scammed. Scammers and hackers are working hard to get to your cryptos, irreversible transactions is a Godsend for them.
Thanks for explaining this, my gut said the price was bullshit, but I had no framework to understand why. You are welcome.
Although i must add, that there is a lot more into this story and i am just a random person on internet trying to make sense of it. And perhaps most of all, this is also just a theoretical explanation, until proven. Honestly, as i said in the post, my main objective is trying to protect people from losing their hard earned money, as in the very essence of this asset class, for one person to profit, someone else or more likely, many others, majority really, has to lose.
That is majority, what this speculative game is currently about. There are of course some projects, exceptions out there etc. That is it, and i fucking hate it. I appreciate the time to explain it. Bitcoin seems energy hungry and outdated compared to newer coins. So it just seems like straight bs to me at this point.
A ponzi scheme is what I would call it too. I like blockchain as an invention and i would love to see it developed naturally, to see where it might go and what positive effect it could have on society and people.